Closed hearings to examine harnessing artificial intelligence cyber capabilities; to be immediately followed by an open hearing at 3:30 p.m. in SR-232A.

Senate Subcommittee on Cybersecurity

2025-03-25

Source: Congress.gov

Summary

The subcommittee convened to discuss the critical state of U.S. Navy conventional shipbuilding, acknowledging significant challenges in delivering ships on time and within budget [ 00:07:57 ]

. Members and witnesses alike underscored the urgent need for a turnaround to maintain maritime dominance against adversaries like Communist China .

Themes

Navy Shipbuilding Challenges and Performance

The Navy faces severe issues with shipbuilding, with only four out of 41 ships delivered on time and on budget in the last five years, a success rate of less than 10% [ 00:08:25 ]

. These delays and cost overruns are common across many programs, including the Constellation-class frigate, which is now at least three years behind schedule due to immature design, weight growth, and slow approval processes . Historically, programs like the Cruiser Replacement, Littoral Combat Ship, and Zumwalt-class destroyers have also failed to modernize the force effectively . The U.S. is losing ground in naval power to Communist China, which possesses 370 ships and submarines and continues to pioneer innovative designs . Despite a near-doubling of the shipbuilding budget over two decades, the fleet size has remained stagnant, while almost every surface ship faces significant delays . The Navy's readiness levels also fall short, with surface ships at 62% and submarines at 67% compared to an 80% standard .

Workforce and Industrial Base Issues

The industrial base supporting naval shipbuilding is in poor shape, struggling with supply chain disruptions, workforce shortages, and inflation . While there is latent capacity in shipyards, recruitment and retention are major challenges [ 00:15:43 ]

[ 00:16:33 ] . Although hiring has increased significantly—with 9,700 employees hired in 2023 and another 10,000 projected for 2024—attrition rates among first-year employees are high (50-60%) due to inadequate wages . Wages for shipbuilders are currently about 1.2 times the living wage, a drastic reduction from the 3-4 times seen in previous decades . Investments in infrastructure and modernization, along with support for apprenticeship programs, are crucial for workforce development and retention . The Navy needs to hire approximately 200,000 people this decade to meet shipbuilding demands . Dr. Seidel cited the example of the Toyota/GM Fremont plant, where empowering workers led to dramatically improved efficiency and job satisfaction .

Acquisition Strategy and Oversight

A fundamental flaw in the Navy's approach to shipbuilding is the reliance on unrealistic business cases, which are based on optimistic assumptions about technology, design knowledge, and funding . This optimism leads to awarding contracts for ships that cannot be built with available resources, resulting in cost overruns and delays . The Government Accountability Office (GAO) has issued 90 recommendations since 2015, with over 60 remaining unaddressed, focusing on ensuring design finalization before construction begins and detailing design for each block [ 00:48:06 ]

. The Constellation-class frigate program exemplified this issue, with the builder (Fincantieri) making 80% of changes and the Navy 20%, leading to significant delays and cost increases under a fixed-price incentive fee contract . Admiral Downey confirmed that the builder, losing money, intentionally slowed down work on the frigate [ 00:29:54 ] . Senators criticized the lack of accountability and the tendency for high turnover in leadership to dilute responsibility [ 01:30:55 ] .

Future Initiatives and Solutions

Speakers emphasized the need for immediate, bold, and transformative action to change how the Navy acquires ships . Proposed solutions include adopting iterative approaches, enhancing collaboration, strengthening in-house expertise, and utilizing digital tools to improve design and oversight . Dr. Seidel noted that the Navy is working to ensure a smooth transition from DDG 51 to DDGX programs, involving build yards in design to avoid past mistakes [ 00:43:39 ]

. There's also a focus on smaller, non-traditional capabilities like robotic autonomous systems, which could be built in smaller shipyards [ 00:38:57 ] . Increasing starting wages for shipbuilders by 25% would only add about 1% to the cost of a ship and could significantly improve retention [ 01:01:57 ] . The possibility of a White House Office of Shipbuilding was mentioned, though details are still pending [ 01:02:41 ] .

Tone of the Meeting

The meeting's tone was predominantly concerned and urgent, reflecting a consensus that the current state of Navy shipbuilding is unacceptable and poses a national security risk [ 00:07:57 ]

. Speakers expressed frustration with persistent issues like cost overruns, schedule delays, and a lack of accountability, despite numerous recommendations from oversight bodies [ 01:30:55 ] . There was a strong sense of resolve and a bipartisan willingness to work towards solutions and implement significant changes in acquisition strategies, workforce development, and infrastructure [ 00:09:46 ] . While acknowledging the bravery and performance of current Navy personnel, the underlying message was a stern call for systemic reform to prevent further decline in U.S. maritime dominance .

Participants

Transcript

Thank you, each of you, for being here.  I'm Honorary Service Chair of this important subcommittee, and I look forward to working with my colleague, Ranking Member Kane from Virginia, to ensure our Navy has the ships and resources they need.  The Navy is very significant to both of us.  First off, I want to introduce our witnesses.  We're joined by three experts in the state of our nation's naval shipbuilding, starting with Dr. Brett Seidel, who serves as the Acting Assistant Secretary of the Navy for Research.   development and acquisition, and is responsible for the overall management for shipbuilding programs.  Nice, easy time.  Next is Vice Admiral James Downey, who serves as the commander of the Naval Sea Systems Command, providing technical direction, contracting authority, construction oversight, and other critical functions for Navy shipbuilding.   And finally, Shelby Oakley, who is the Director for Contracting and National Security Acquisitions at the Government Accounting Office, where she has received our shipbuilding efforts, has reviewed our shipbuilding efforts extensively.  Thank you again for being here, and thank you for your service to our country.  So many of you have heard me talk about my father.  My dad, I'm blessed.  My doctor dad, he was crazy.  He joined the Army very young, underage.  He was one of...   3,000 Americans did all four combat jumps in the Second World War.  I think he got paid more to do jumps.  He thinks about 80 out of 80 people came back alive.  He told me the Germans were bad, the foxholes were bad, the food was bad, so I joined the Navy.  But I'm proud he did all four combat jumps with the 82nd Airborne that they did and then fought in the Battle of the Bulge.  I thought the food was going to be better, but it was really not very great.   I served as radar man aboard the USS Glover.  I'm proud to be a Navy veteran, but we can all acknowledge that it's facing significant challenges and in need of a turnaround.  President Trump has made clear that his administration is focused on making our military the lethal fighting force it should be, and I'm glad we have a president focused on this.  In the past few years, unfortunately, we've seen the Navy failing to recruit, pass the audit, and most relevant to our discussion today, deliver ships on time and on budget.
In the last five years, 41 ships were delivered to the Navy.  Of those 41 ships, only four were delivered on time and on budget.  That's 9.7%.  So I'm a business guy.  I build businesses.  No one would consider less than 10% success acceptable.  In the private sector, something would have changed.  You wouldn't keep using the same company.  The company would probably go bankrupt.  You'd clearly change people out.   Yet over the past four years, we've seen the Navy failing to improve ships, innovate or deliver things on time and on budget.  That's a failure to the American people who expect their federal government to use their tax dollars wisely and expect their Navy to be on the cutting edge of innovation to defend our national security.  We clearly have to make some changes.  I think my colleague, Senator Kaine, is in the same position.  We want to do everything we can to   help with the turnaround, and we've got to do it fast.  In today's subcommittee on sea power hearing, we will provide oversight on our Navy's conventional surface shipbuilding efforts, see why our naval readiness and shipbuilding are falling behind Communist China, and understand how we can work to rapidly change course.  I have serious concerns about the challenges to our maritime dominance.  The United States is losing ground, unfortunately, to Communist China and naval power, and our shipbuilding enterprise is failing to keep up.   Commerce China Navy has 370 ships and submarines with over 150 major surface combatants, and they continue to pioneer innovative designs like large unmanned surface vessels and carriers for unmanned aircraft.  In contrast, the United States has failed to capitalize its naval shipbuilding since Ronald Reagan led the production surge over four decades ago.  Our surface combatant fleet is growing old, with the average age of a ship succeeding 20 years.   Meanwhile, programs intended to modernize our force have completely failed.  The Cruiser Replacement Program, the Little Combat Ship, the Zumwalt-class destroyers, this failure to modernize forced us to restart production of older DDG-51 Arleigh Burke-class ships as a temporary fix, even though these ships were already desperately in need of innovation to begin with.  What's even more concerning is that we don't seem to be learning from our mistakes or taking any significant steps to improve the process.

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